Cart first. Horse second?
Let’s imagine together. Imagine that there is a church holding a special banquet and everyone is encouraged to invite their friends, neighbors or coworkers. It’s an event pointed not at the fellowship of believers, but just some good old fashioned fun for the community. So Jane decides to invite a coworker of hers named Henry, and his boyfriend Tom.
The Church is not amused. Jane is given a strict talking to for exposing people’s children to homosexuality. Jane is also not amused, because she knows if she’d invited her other coworker, Betsy, and her live-in long-term boyfriend Roger with whom she has a baby, everyone would have blushed but simply ignored talking about their relationship. Henry is also not amused, because he’s curious about Jane and her beliefs and he feels rejected and hurt when she stops talking to him and inviting him to community events.
That church is guilty of putting the cart before the horse. I refuse to accept any of the possible excuses for rejecting Henry. Because they can’t expose their children to homosexuality? Their children may have been exposed to any number of unapproved things over the course of the meal. Someone may have left to go smoking. Old Bill may have been putting shots of whiskey in his Coca-Cola from the hip flask no one talks about. Some of the teenagers may have snuck out to kiss, someone may have cursed, Bob and Timothy may have gotten into another of their infamous fights that always seem to end in a wrestling match… There may be some really conservative people who don’t let their children watch TV, and others who do, and the conservative kids will eventually be exposed to the way the others are raised. My point is: no matter what you believe, your children will eventually be exposed to a differing way of doing things. Sin is inevitable. I refuse to accept that gay people cannot be invited because someone might “catch” the gay, as if it’s a head cold. The other common excuse is by tolerating their presence you are affirming their behavior.
Excuse me while I go in the other room and laugh. The point of tolerance is that one doesn’t agree, but one bears with another. Because if we affirmed everything, there’d never be a reason to “tolerate” anything. We’d all just agree! Gay people know that most Christians don’t like their lifestyle. Inviting them to a community banquet won’t make them forget something like Westboro Baptist parading around with signs reading “God Hates Fags.” Perhaps if we could just learn to eat a meal together, we could talk about why they have accepted their homosexuality and why most Christians can’t, and it could be the start of a beautiful conversation.
Churches need to stop doing things backwards. The path to holiness does not go:
holiness, welcoming, acceptance, discipleship.
It goes more like:
welcoming, acceptance, discipleship, holiness.
So. Let’s hang out a tile that says, “you are welcome here,” and see what happens. I think we have a lot to talk about. We could do it over a nice pizza.
Marissa replied:
I am admittedly not a Christian but this post makes me want to say, “Amen!”
There is an opposite stance that the Christian community never ackowledges. Gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender and any other “deviant” sexual identities (along with anyone engaging in other sinful acts) have to constantly “tolerate” Christians that openly spout hate. Tolerance goes both ways and needs to in order for us all to co-exist. Thank you for being an open minded Christian and trying to open other minds.
Best,
Marissa
March 4, 2008 at 1:48 pm. Permalink.
Matthew replied:
Shush-
Another post slam-dunk, girl! I love the way you write. You say the things I’m thinking but can’t seem to get out on “paper”.
Marissa-
It’s ok for non-Christians to say, “Amen!”. Thank you for being tolerant of my more conservative Brothers and Sisters in Christ who can’t seem to get that “Love your neighbor as yourself” applies to everybody!!!
Grace and Peace,
Matty
March 4, 2008 at 6:14 pm. Permalink.
amberfireinus replied:
God doesnt make mistakes. He made us ALL perfect. Just the way we are. Even if that means gay.
March 4, 2008 at 6:41 pm. Permalink.
jaklumen replied:
I agree.
People have long, long misunderstood tolerance. Tolerance does not mean, “I must accept what you have chosen,” tolerance means “I will love you and accept YOU anyway.”
This is sure to get my queer brethren in a tizzy, I think (yes, I’ll be honest, I still experience it) but churches/The Church really does not have to change their stance to do this. They don’t. That does NOT exclude them welcoming others to worship, to socialize, to fellowship.
“Judge not, that you not be judged in turn; but if you must judge, judge righteously,” to paraphrase the old saying, to the best of my personal understanding. If the rules remain that you cannot do something, so be it. I will not deny leaders their ability to enforce the rules as have been stated.
At best, they are facilitators. The remainder remains a private matter between the individual and their God, and the others need to stay the hell out, literally.
More uncomfortableness: if leadership was passed to my hands, this is how I see it: if someone breaks the rules, then there are some limitations per se how the rules are structured. But those limitations do not preclude them coming to meetings, coming to social activities, and well, if people have to swallow it and move on, so be it. It’s not their decision.
I know some will most fervently disagree with me… but, that is what I have to say.
March 4, 2008 at 7:44 pm. Permalink.
shush replied:
Marissa: Thank you. I agree, there is the reverse tolerance, the grudging acceptance of intolerance. There are a lot of Christians who get up in arms about the “gay community” and it’s aggression towards Christianity, but after so many years of intolerance on our end I think we’ve earned it a little.
Matt: thank you! I really try.
Amber: Thank you, so much. I rarely outright state my own views on Homosexuality just because it’s all so controversial and people will ignore what I’m really saying just to restate the accepted view. But God knit us together in the womb, there is some good to be brought of every aspect of who we are. Christians should talk openly with homosexuals and see what we can learn from them and their journey- without judgment.
Jaklumen: thank you for your comment. I agree that there is some accountability that needs to be had, but that needs to come from the fostering of relationships. There will be no relationship if one is never let in the front door.
March 5, 2008 at 5:02 pm. Permalink.
anita replied:
Aaaaa-chooooooo!
Oh sorry for sneezing on your blog but really, I promise, it’s not contagious!
You said, “Gay people know that most Christians don’t like their lifestyle.” As a Christian who is also lesbian (which probably explains my nasty head cold although why, I can’t imagine and don’t want to) I don’t know that MOST Christians don’t like my lifestyle. What I know is that MANY Christians don’t have a clue as to my lifestyle. They don’t know my prayer life. They don’t know my personal relationship with Christ. They’re clueless as to God’s call on my life. They’re in the dark at knowing the extent of the love and commitment my partner and I have for one another. And they would be shocked and stunned to see how we wash our clothes, shop for fresh produce and set up tables for an after church fellowship hour. Just one big abomination from start to finish.
There’s no question that alot of GLBTQ people have a negative view of Christianity for the reason you mentioned but at the same time, I think that’s changing in that they’re beginning to recognize that Christianity is diverse and that the loudest voices aren’t the only ones.
Oh and that banquet in the church…check to see who’s setting up the tables and slipping on the plastic tablecloths the next time you all break bread together …
March 5, 2008 at 9:12 pm. Permalink.
littletiger replied:
Shush - I’ve got to admit you’ve been addressing so many things that I’ve thought about and never really been able to voice well. I’ve got several gay friends and the one thing I know I can’t have any kind of relationship with them if I judge them. I can’t share Christ with them if all I do is reject them because of their lifestyle. How can I become more like Christ who ate with all kinds of people if I can’t do the basic thing of just loving all people. Thanks again for your great blogs.
March 6, 2008 at 1:48 am. Permalink.
shush replied:
Anita: That reminds me of this joke about the GLBT agenda- “1) make awesome mushroom omelet for breakfast 2) pick out the best outfit for dog-walking 3) say hi to the people in the neighborhood 4) assemble lasagna for carry-in 5) dismantle all morality 6) pick up thoughtful gifts for the hostess 7) make handmade card…” *sighs* How hard is it to believe that gay people are just like us, just with a different trigger for attraction? There is one man at my church I didn’t know was gay until after we’d been friends for a YEAR. He kept to himself, other than participating in discussions, and he always brought something to church meals and stayed late to help clean up. Thank GOD our church accepted and embraced him.
littletiger:thanks for all of the marvelous comments! It’s always good to find a kindred spirit.
March 6, 2008 at 12:37 pm. Permalink.
anita replied:
Shush,
Okay. So how do you know gay jokes I don’t know! Interesting and yet somehow at the same time…disturbing.
March 6, 2008 at 8:29 pm. Permalink.
Allyson replied:
The more I read your blog, Shush, the more I want to co-pastor a church with you. =)
March 8, 2008 at 9:16 pm. Permalink.
shush replied:
Anita: That joke actually started in the political world as a “leaked” agenda. I’ve heard it a few more times since then, but almost always in a political context.
thanks! That’s do kind of you! I’ve been hearing a lot of vague inferences to me pastoring lately. It would make my pastor daddy so proud!
Allyson:
March 10, 2008 at 12:28 pm. Permalink.
Sane Christian replied:
At a religious gathering people should not have to be subject to blatant sin. If it were a picnic in a park you expect to see sin around you and blatant. Homosexuals who go to a church gathering as a couple in a ‘committed relationship’ aren’t seeking God and his love.
Parents have the God given responsibility to protect their children from things of this world.
Sane
June 9, 2008 at 1:18 am. Permalink.
Lindsey replied:
Sane: I suppose you and I are a bit different… because I see that everyone sins. And as a parent I realize that I cannot shield my children from all things, instead I teach them how to cope with the inevitable sins of others.
June 9, 2008 at 2:08 am. Permalink.
Lindsey replied:
Oh, and I felt I made it clear in the post that this was an event for the community, to which unbelievers would be invited? Do we only invite guests who live up to a certain standard, or welcome all?
June 9, 2008 at 2:10 am. Permalink.
Sane Christian replied:
There are events that can be held for unbelievers. It’s called church. But there should not be ‘family’ events were all kinds of sin will show up.
I would not take my child to an event if I knew a Satanist was going to be there. That would be asking for spiritual trouble.
We are to raise up our children in the way they should go. Not a send them through a spiritual boot camp under the guise of ‘family event’.
June 9, 2008 at 2:18 am. Permalink.