The church has been usurped to be used for political means. This CAN NOT stand.
If you think that Chick-Fil-A day was just about Free Speech, you have been misled. We cannot trust those who pose as authorities in our faith, the faith has been compromised. Mike Huckabee stated that Chick-Fil-A day was about “basic fairness” and that people needed to “stop being afraid someone might have a different view than them.” Huckabee, and others speaking similarly to him, posed the whole debate as if it was just about free speech. The dialogue portrayed liberals as intolerant people who want to quash the conservative voice because they didn’t want anyone disagreeing with them. The issue was made primarily about Cathy’s affirmative statement towards “traditional” marriage.
Many liberals, sadly, played into that hand just enough to make Cathy’s supporter’s argument for them, which is tragic.
The issue was never about Cathy’s personal views. The issue, for the gay community, was always about where he spent the WinShape foundation’s cash, the WinShape foundation being funded by Chick-Fil-A’s money.
That issue is inarguable, and central to the topic of Christianity being co-opted for political means.
Now, picture this: hundreds of thousands of people in the liberal vote are steaming mad because they find out that a little portion of every dollar spend at Chick-Fil-A goes to fund groups that say things like “gay people are more likely to molest your children” and have actively worked to keep sodomy laws on the books. It may only be a minuscule portion of each dollar, an nth of a penny, but that isn’t what matters. What matters is that in a free society there are still people who want to keep consenting sex between two adults of the same gender illegal, and that Cathy has either knowingly or unknowingly contributed to the continuation of such work. What matters is that there are people who believe that gay people are more likely to molest your children, have mental illness, and commit other kinds of crimes. That people use faulty studies from over forty years ago done in prisons to back up wildly misleading statistics, and they actively work to educate people in a way that is at it’s best deeply flawed but at it’s worst purposefully misleading. That the church turns a blind eye to such actions being taken out in it’s name is appalling. There is no other word. It is flawed silence such as that which contributes to the openly defended bigotry so many gay people are injured by, and it is that bigotry that builds the foundation of fear, contempt, and self-hatred that leads such a disproportionate amount of gay teens to commit suicide.
Gay people have every right to be angry that people are blindly funneling money into making sex with their partners and spouses illegal and to prevent more states from allowing gay marriage. But if that was the only issue, I think that there would be a lot less vitriol in this argument. There should be no one, Christian or non-Christian, gay affirming or same-sex-marriage-not-wanting, who would agree that it is good to continue to spread literature which claims that science proves that being gay is a grave disorder which threatens society, posing gay people as frightening bugaboos who will tear your community to the ground, literature which the Family Research Council relies on to scare people into funding it.
This sort of literature is antithetical to the call to love your neighbors.
It is judgmental at it’s core, breeds only condemnation, and leaves no room for redemption to be birthed.
It does fall within the province of free speech. The Family Research council has a right to produce it, and Cathy has a right to fund it if he chooses to.
But do Christians have an obligation to defend it?
Is it, as Huckabee claimed, an issue of basic fairness? Is the gay community’s opposition to such literature being funded an issue of not tolerating anyone having a different point of view than them?
When thousands of people lined up around street corners and bought so many waffle fries some stores had to close early, what the gay community saw was not a redeeming love. They didn’t even see Christians lining up to show support for their brethren’s right to free speech. What they saw was an attack. They said, “we don’t want money going to make more hate speech preached under the guise of science and Christian education”, and they saw thousands of people line up to say, “we’re going to throw as much money at that as we can.”
What I saw, from my lonely corner of the world, was thousands of people being manipulated into creating a political schema for the upcoming election. What I saw was a framework for the Republican candidate being able to call liberals whiny and intolerant and unwilling to let capitalism work for the other side.
What I saw was the church falling on it’s own sword.
How many people do you think took the time to actually talk to someone on the other side of the problem? How many parroted what the powers that be told them and believed it whole cloth with the naivete of a child. As if there was no one who could possibly want to take advantage of their belief that Christians ought to trust one another. We were told that we needed to defend Cathy’s right to tell the truth.
The truth is it’s own defense.
If Cathy told “the truth” and was boycotted as a result, he’d be storing up treasures in jars of clay regardless. It was not our job to defend him. God is his defender, the lifter of his head, his strong tower. Cathy didn’t need thousands of people ordering chicken sandwiches.
Gay people did need to know that God loves them, and doesn’t want them to be caused pain.
Truth was not defended.
Truth was ignored.
The call to arms should not have been to spend money at a capitalist establishment to defend a right that had never been infringed on.
The call to arms must be to reach out to the other side in love.
” The dialogue portrayed liberals as intolerant people who want to quash the conservative voice because they didn’t want anyone disagreeing with them.” I believe this to be an accurate statement. When speaking about the LGBT movement I can not recall (not even once, much with any regularity) a conservative calling a liberal an intolerant, bigot, etc.. Conversely the liberals tend to more typically come right out with the name calling.
““gay people are more likely to molest your children” and have actively worked to keep sodomy laws on the books.” Chile molestation is based on the age of the victim and not (necessarily) the gender of the victim. I believe the second part of this statement is spot-on.
” What matters is that there are people who believe that gay people are more likely to molest your children, have mental illness, and commit other kinds of crimes.” Techincally speaking you are correct. But be fair. Statistics prove that those with these beliefs have fallen dramatically in the last decade. However, I can not recall any instances where heterosexuals have a HETEROSEXUAL PRIDAY PARADE and prance around with their genetalia tightly wrapped and acting lewdly. Drunk people sure but both “camps” have stupid drunks.
“That people use faulty studies from over forty years ago done in prisons to back up wildly misleading statistics, and they actively work to educate people in a way that is at it’s best deeply flawed but at it’s worst purposefully misleading.” People? Of course people who have convicted of sex crimes and others who have sought out counseling are the ones used to gather statistics. The uniknown are the perverts who are still out there perverting around. We can not know their motivation(s). Therefore any statistic used to either prove or disprove statements by either side is flawed. No one can tell. When it comes to children I tend to be more cautious. Which means I won’t let anyone whom I do not trust 100% have access to any of my children/grandchildren (I do mean anyone too. Coaches, teachers, etc.).
This sort of literature is antithetical to the call to love your neighbors.” This “love your neighbor” argument is a two sided sword. If I believe my neighbor is involved in a behavior that will ultimately lead to their destruction or eternal damnation, what am I to do? Does love included a kind word which they may reject… only when I am approached?
“It is judgmental at it’s core, breeds only condemnation, and leaves no room for redemption to be birthed.” Redemption is not the job of the believer. Redemption comes only through the work of the Cross by the Savior. The duty of the believer is to speak truth in love (some spread seed. some water, etc.). I don’t see anywhere in Holy Scripture where practicing the love of Christ means to tell someone only what they want to hear. Conversely, neither do I see where causing another person emotional or physical pain is of Christ-like love.
“What they saw was an attack.” Most people see what they expect to see. Gays are not exempt from this.
“Gay people did need to know that God loves them, and doesn’t want them to be caused pain.” Absolutely! Just don’t confuse God’s love, mercy and grace as His approval for whatever the issue is you believe to be acceptable.
I took my family to the Chick Fil A thing. The reason I did was not to call anyone a sinner or too tell any group that they are a second class citizens.
The reason I took my family was, it was a simple act I could (personally) do to say that I am sick and tired of having LGBTs agenda pushed in my face. It seems I no longer have a voice in the left leaning of politics or the media, so if purchsing a piece of chicken could in some small way make ME feel like I had a small say then it was worth my $13.00 and change.
As for the Hetero Pride Parade: helllooooooooo Cinco De Mayo. And that’s not the only time that heterosexuals walk around with their boy parts out and their boobs flapping in the wind. Regardless of which, how is that really a valid argument? The people that do that are just one subset of the population, and the gay people who never have nor never would do such things really don’t deserve to be punished because *some* homosexuals are offensive, any more than I should bear the brunt of American college girls flashing their breasts all over the place because of what *other* girls do at Cinco de Mayo.
I agree, practicing God’s love doesn’t mean telling them what they want to hear. But it does mean abstaining from telling lies that are incredibly harmful, which is what some of the groups that Cathy donates to do. You said that such beliefs are falling off in popularity- GOOD, because such beliefs are WRONG. But the groups Cathy actively supports are trying to spread those beliefs- so your argument doesn’t really contradict mine.
And as for your being tired of the LGBT agenda… what agenda? Wanting people to not believe that they are child molesting criminals with mental illnesses who ought to be ostracized from our society?
Special protection under the law. NOT equal protection.
Civil Rights violations?? Seriously? I have never met a person who used to be black. Behavior is not an ethnic group.
Same sex attraction is NOT a behavior. It is not something that someone chooses. I have not met a single gay person that did not describe having always felt different, feeling that their attraction to people of the same sex was not something they could control. I suppose you can argue that someone can deny their attraction and live out a hetero lifestyle, but numerous studies back up the far reaching implications of such choices as being incredibly negative for someone’s mental health and leading to a higher rate of mental illness like depression or even suicide. It’s hard to get firm numbers, because obviously it’s hard to get a representative sample to work from, but still…
It’s not a behavior. It is a state of being over which an individual cannot exercise total control.
They do not deserve to be victimized based off of something they can’t control, which is why like black people and other ethnic and social groups they deserve protection.
It’s not about behavior. The fact that you continue to show judgment in your own attitudes, attributing sexuality to behavior and sin and ignoring the reality of people’s lives, is pretty much all the proof I need that the Christian backlash against the gay community on this one is founded on rhetoric and not love.
Victims are victims. Tell a heterosexual’s family who is on life support with brain damage that the crime against him will not garner as great a penalty simply because of his sexual preference. Yeh, that makes total sense.
“They do not deserve to be victimized” Is there a list of acceptable people who deserve to victimized? That is just absurd.
Saying that a gay person should be able to be fired just because they are gay means you are fine with them being victimized. So, apparently, gay people are on your list of acceptable victims.
What is the real issue here? I think part of the problem is people who go to a very traditional, Christian based restaurant that even closes on Sunday’s and then are upset that they are against what everyone should have known they stand for. This restaurant never hid what it stood for.
“The issue was never about Cathy’s personal views. The issue, for the gay community, was always about where he spent the WinShape foundation’s cash, the WinShape foundation being funded by Chick-Fil-A’s money.” I have a problem with this right here. A private business, funding a foundation and funneling that money to something it believes in. Who should be able to control what is given to who? We live in a free market, or did until Obama the socialist started the destruction of our great country.
Abercrombie, Hollister, Ben and Jerry’s ice cream all support the gay and lesbian agenda, if you don’t like it don’t shop there, if you don’t mind then it doesn’t matter. I don’t believe it is worth making a big deal about.
Another point, if Christians made a big deal about not shopping at a private place of business that supported the gay or liberal agenda they would be crushed by the liberal community. So why are people so surprised that when the liberals put up a stink the Christians responded? I am not saying this was the right way to come across. It did not show the gay community what Christ’s actions would have been.
Are Christians not able to have public opinions? It would seem we are not allowed to free speech.
I want to end with this. I have a cousin who is gay. I do not hate, love wins. He is still the same person he always was. I love him regardless, I may not agree with his stance but it is his choice not mine. I have a belief, I do not believe that someone is born gay or straight, there is no gay or straight gene, science cannot prove this to be true. Is it acceptable for me to hold this belief or can I not have a belief such as this because it contradicts the liberal mindset.
having grown up in a conservative Mennonite community where no one thought it was acceptable to shop at Abercrombie and no one bought Ben and Jerry’s or even shopped at Target, I find your “if the shoe were on the other foot” argument totally inapplicable.
No one is trying to *control* where Cathy spends his money, they are just taking a stand that they aren’t going to spend their money on prejudicial work against them. This is a free economy- Cathy is free to do as he will, and people are free to *not support it*, just like all the Christians I know that don’t shop at target, don’t buy Abercrombie, and will never eat Ben and Jerry’s.
Oh and sexual preference is not the same as a race. That does not even make sense.
As a (very) small business owner I can’t think how sexual preference should come up at work. Seriously, if you are working in an environment where sex comes up, someone is doing a pretty poor job of managing.
I believe an employer should hire the best individual for the job reguardless of anything other than job qualifications.
That being said, an employer should to also dismiss anyone at any time for any reason what so ever. It’s their business NOT the government’s.
Here’s how sex comes up at work: your spouse or significant other brings you lunch.
And you think it’s okay that people are fired for no reason other than that they are gay? Or a woman should be able to be fired when she gets pregnant?
At my place of employment I have been harassed for being a Christian. Does that mean I am a victim? Life is not fair and it wont ever be.
There are two people with whom I work that are lesbians. No, it is not okay for them to be fired just because they are gay, just as it is not acceptable for a woman to be fired when she is pregnant. I plan to open a business in the next few years would not fire someone just based on sexual orientation. I find it very hard to believe a good company would fire someone for their sexual orientation if they are truly performing well.
Playing the blame game and trying to decide who are victims of certain things in this matter is just petty. Sorry, life is not fair and times are the worst they have been since the great depression and getting worse.
Anonymous, your comment was clearly lacking sympathy. I think God cares when people are victimized. I think Jesus intentionally chose to relate to those who were the most cast out of society- the lepers, the tax collectors, the prostitutes and “sinners”. No, life isn’t fair. But people questioning you because of your faith is a side effect of having it. Jesus never said “follow me and your path will be easy”, that’s not the deal. We follow him and we are put through endless trials as well we should be, because it is those trials that birth perseverance and perseverance that builds character.
You CHOSE to follow God.
I don’t know anyone who CHOSE to be gay. Whether or not they are victimized is absolutely worth talking about. If they are the least of our society, as so many feel they are treated, then when we minister to them we are doing as Christ commanded.
Gay marriage is happening and gay rights are only a matter of time. The Chick-Fil-A thing is the dying gasp of a now-minority that is coming to grasp with the realization that things are substantially changing in our culture.
The same thing happened after Obama was elected; that is why so many otherwise intelligent people jumped at the idea that Obama was a Kenyan socialist. NOW there are policy issues that people can substantially disagree with him on but back then there really was nothing…hence the birther thing.
I, personally, had no problem with Cathay’s comments nor do I have any problem with where Chick-Fil-A elects to send their money. No one has alleged that Chick-Fil-A has broken any laws and as far as the Supreme Court is concerned, corporations have ‘freedom of speech’. (Sigh.)
Target, for instance, also contributes money to groups that are anti-gay.
I DO have a problem with people who decide how everyone in the land of the free have to live based on religious rule. That is not ok. But expressing an opinion? Go for it. Just don’t think for a second that it means that the rest of the country has to take it as gospel, as it were.